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Timespan of Technique development
Timespan of Technique development
in PB Guitarstudio FORUMS Tue Jul 17, 2012 9:12 pmby Dansimonin • 11 Posts
When working on a technique, to what degree should you develop it before moving onto another exercise? For example, with say the spiders, after getting it down with all the timings at 50bpm should you stop there or develop it more. I decided to work up to 80bpm(quintuplets) but then i stopped because I wasn't sure whether I should develop it more. Because of this I keep putting myself in this huge technique rut where i work something a little then keep jumping around and never really mastering anything. Or should you take it as a lifetime thing where it never ends?
replyRE: Timespan of Technique development
in PB Guitarstudio FORUMS Wed Jul 18, 2012 6:50 amby deltadiscos • 321 Posts
Well I got em to 280 bpm quarter notes except a couple. so I don't concentrate on them so much now but still run through them. nearly everyday
RE: Timespan of Technique development
in PB Guitarstudio FORUMS Wed Jul 18, 2012 8:12 amby uderoche (deleted)
My advice would be DO NOT let yourself get caught in a rut. It happens to all of us. When I first started with Pebber that was one of my BIGGEST problems. I kept doing the same stuff over and over again. You do need massive amounts of repetition over days, weeks, months, years. However, don't let yourself get caught into just doing spider exercises. Practice them daily but move on. Learn some scales. Practice some picking. Do some trills. Learn some songs. Start a band. Go out and play. Don't get caught sitting in your bedroom doing spider exercises all day. You'll drive yourself insane. Trust me. It takes a lifetime to master these things. And an extreme amount of mental discipline. I'm not saying to STOP spider exercises, but, manage your time so that you can work on a few things. But, not so many that you are losing focus. If that makes sense.
-Ursin
RE: Timespan of Technique development
in PB Guitarstudio FORUMS Thu Jul 19, 2012 6:46 amby AceLuby • 63 Posts
Balance is key. I try to keep to a few exercises and move through each of them every day. Trill, spider, picking w/ a metronome, scales (going through single string scales right now), permutations, ladder, chord exercises w/ a jazz chord book, blues exercises w/ a blues lick book, arpeggios, and at least 10 min a day of just open jamming. I can do all of this in about two hour and a half sessions which I do before and after dinner, and then I do spider, trill, and picking w/ a sock over the neck as I watch TV w/ the gf until I go to bed (usually another 2-3 hours). This seems to be the best way to get the time in while still balancing work and wife.
RE: Timespan of Technique development
in PB Guitarstudio FORUMS Thu Jul 19, 2012 3:55 pmby John567 • 156 Posts
How much time does one have available? I remember listening to an audio book while I was traveling back from Toronto... I can't remember the name of it but the author's name was Malcolm Gladwell. I remember him talking about how long it takes to "master" something. He stated his research lead him to believe it took 10,000 hours.
If that number is right then we can estimate how long it might take. So, lets say you have the ability to practice 8 hours a day. So...
10,000 hours/8 hours per day = 1250 days
1250 days/1 year = 3.42 years
That seems to be too short of a time. It feels to me that it should take longer. Maybe my math is fucked... :D
Then I'm thinking you have to take into consideration the amount of material you wish to cover, when to move to the next BPM and by how much, how much time to spend on one thing over another, etc.
I only got 4 hours I can squeeze in after work. I keep a spread sheet to keep track of it all. I usually keep everything down to 10 minutes for each thing I want to practice. I brake things down to 4 basic elements: Right Hand Picking (Pebber's dvd), Scales, Arpeggios, Chords. The last three are usually dealt with in context of a song I'm trying to learn. Because I really love jazz music its easy to find lead sheets to learn from.
I don't always stick to this format. Sometimes I have to change things up to keep me motivated and energized. But, eventually I go back to this format.
Again I don't know about the 10,000 hour thing. But, it might give some perspective.
RE: Timespan of Technique development
in PB Guitarstudio FORUMS Thu Jul 19, 2012 5:03 pmby Dansimonin • 11 Posts
Ya that books called the outliers. I am well aware of the 10,000 hour rule and I have tons of time to practice.(and I use that time) I was just dwelling on how long you should develop something before going to another exersice. But thanks for the help I'm pretty sure that I Know what to do to get out of this rut.
RE: Timespan of Technique development
in PB Guitarstudio FORUMS Thu Jul 19, 2012 10:08 pmby pebberbrown • 926 Posts
Sometimes you have to move on. I had a kid today come in for a lesson and we worked on sightreading. He kept blowing it badly over and over again. We went over the same thing about 5-6 times and the last time he completely screwed it up. He said "lets do it again."
I said "NO LETS MOVE ON." We then went to the next page in the book. He screwed that up completely as well almost as if he never saw it before. We went over it again 3-4 times and he wanted to do it again a 5th time. I said NO and turned the page. There is a point when you have to press on even if you dont have something 100% perfect - however and its a BIG however - you SHOULD go back and review it later to nail it. If you are playing in a big band or orchestra and working on a piece of music - you have to play it right with no mistakes so that means you have to get it down 100% with the time you have available. Thats realtime pressure in the music business. If you are working on exercises, trills, spiders, scales, right hand etc. you can ALWAYS come back to them later. So many people are in RUTS with EVERYTHING because they dont press on and move forward and let go of imperfections and just move to the next space. However if you want to master ANYTHING on a musical instrument it takes repeated diligent practice hour after hour day after day week after week. The question is - are you spending too much time on exercises rather that learning pieces of real music? I would say you need to spend more efforts on real music - the exercises you will ALWAYS have available for life - but the actual music - thats where you want to focus the ultimate practicing.
RE: Timespan of Technique development
in PB Guitarstudio FORUMS Fri Jul 20, 2012 4:13 pmby hudsontoronto • 79 Posts
I spent this whole week of practice "13 hours so far " and I only practiced picking exercises module 1 exercises 1, some spider exercises, and worked on perfecting the 14 position system...
am I missing the point here?
I think that next week practice I will start working on the 14 position system for warm-up since I am using both hands I will be saving some time and than move on to something different.
I don`t know if I should start on the MM or work on some jazz standards ! or maybe I can do both...... oh yeah i need arpeggios as well...
I guess I will have to change my daily practice every week... but than again ...am I going to get good at something if I don`t stick to it?
cheers...
RE: Timespan of Technique development
in PB Guitarstudio FORUMS Fri Jul 20, 2012 10:11 pmby pebberbrown • 926 Posts
Hudson in your case I wanted you to spend 2 weeks minimum doing the module 1 exercise and now look at you. YOU have already lost your attention span and are drifting to too many other ideas. The plan is for a reason.
RE: Timespan of Technique development
in PB Guitarstudio FORUMS Sat Jul 21, 2012 3:51 amby hudsontoronto • 79 Posts
Thanks for the reply Pebber.
I didn't know that it was a plan for two weeks on module 1...
I will stay on it four weeks if you say that I need to stay...
You have been teaching guitar for many decades and I trust your strategy is going to work...
It is boring to do the same thing every day but I will do what ever it takes for how long it takes...
I'm not drifting, I'm putting al my practice time on it 100%.
Thanks for the video that you sent me last night...I absolutely canot play with pick 2 3 4... Hehehe..
Thanks for the support .
RE: Timespan of Technique development
in PB Guitarstudio FORUMS Sat Jul 21, 2012 4:39 pmby pebberbrown • 926 Posts
Hudson I think your entire problem is based on that fact that you have drifted all over the place for far too long. A little of this a little of that - never really mastering anything thoroughly. You have to ask yourself - do you want to get good or do you want to pass the time and just entertain yourself? Getting good requires BORING repetitive stuff - not for days or weeks but for years. I am still practicing on Module 1 every day after doing it for 36-37-38 years already. McLaughlin still works on the same stuff he always does but ADDS to it later on. I wanted you to stay on module 1 for AT LEAST 2 weeks and THEN see what kind of prgress you made first hand. Only YOU can determine if you got better at something and how much. Drifting around and dabbling in everything will leave you exactly where you started - merely passing the time and entertaining yourself. If you want to get good you have to quit fucking around and get serious.
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