Yeah this is where i use them as well. For a lot of chord melody work, or variations when playing rhythm(accenting vocals and things of that nature). Although i get a load of road miles out of the min7/maj6 substitution, using various inversion to pull this off really helps me have some really nice chords in my rhythm playing.
I know this was addressed to Pebber, but i had a similar experience. I played all through highschool from tabs and chord charts, knowing enough basic knowledge to get me by. The big thing that helped me theory wise, was learning to read music. I worked my way through the book one Berklee Modern guitar method, and then having to take music theory lessons with the college im at...well that really helped me understand the theory.
Although im sure Pebber will have an evern better method.
Chord tones also sound much more correct to the chord.
For instnace, if your playing an A chord in the key of A, you definitely dont want to hit the 4(D) and the 7(Ab) of the major scale, as for a standard three note triad major chord, this notes will clash with the playing of the chord itself.
When using arpeggio;s, they are usually made up entirely of chord tones, so in this case its much more a case of playing on safe ground.
One exercise a teacher gave to me once to get the wrist twist correct, was to crank the guitar, as he called it.
As you start the vibrato, try pulling the guitar neck up a little as u go up, and relax it down. Exaggerate at first, then ull find the more you practice you actually use less and less of the crank and be able to launch straight into the vibrato.
He is still using all the theoretical guidelines(i hate calling them rules) of melody. Including those of dischord.
Also please notice that schoenberg is reading...Which means he isnt just making up a bunch of licks mumbo jumbo, but he has structure to his pieces. I can hear the dischord, but its not dissonant. The difference i hear is like someone arguing that a third and 11th can be used in a 11th chord. It just doesnt sound right.
As i said earlier, it does nothing for my ear. And thats what ill say.. Im not knocking his speed, and i would be calling mick barr sensational if he used every technique in relation to a melodic motif.
I myself was not intending to push any of my views down anyone;s throat as well. I just found this a great example of speed triumphing over melody.
As i said, i list Greg Howe as an example, only because he is someone who has impressed me lately with both virtuostic technique applied to melody.
Take notic of the whole song, and check some of the speed playing towards the end. Yeah its super fast playing and its in relation to melody. This is why i find someone like greg howe a genius, and i say that mick has great technique just seems to me like he doesnt use it in a melodic sense.
I do enjoy fast playing, but the reason weiner, yngwie and all the others got where they are is because of melody. They have speed playing and use it melodically.
I can play fast, yes, Ive spent hours working on speed techniques, and im here to learn from pebber to get even faster. And yes..if your hearing a fast melody, ur hearing melody arent you?
I'm not pushing my view of playing. You asked me to check something out, and it does nothing for me. Im not knocking the fact he can play fast...all due respect to that fact, but i dont get anything melodic from that, like i would when i listen to all the players you previously listed.
I'm really starting to wonder if i came to the right place. The moment i stated what i thought when asked of a video, i get asked all kind of..are you serious questions?
Just to me the moment i said that was doing nothing for me everyone jumped down my throat because i said exactly how it sounded to my ear. And that is king, that does not sound any good to me ear. Just like a bunch of licks thrown together. If the ears tell you its wrong, its wrong.
Having played professionally for the last 5-6 years, made a living of guitar, playing in country and jazz bands...we would pick the guitar player playing melody every time over someone with unlimited virtuostic talent, who cannot get onto the melody.
You need melody well and truly before speed.
And yeah i am serious.
Look at the greats like Lenny Tristano...wouldnt let satch keep going on a lesson if he played a wrong note. Its about melody, not speed.
I might have to use that as my sig here lol.
As i said guys, in no way am i rubbishing his technique. I just dont like the lack of melody.
Is it really such a new concept to relate everything we do on guitar solo's back to melody?
No he isnt creating melodies, he is just creating noise.
Have we all forgotten that music needs a melody? The magic of song itself is in chords and melody, all we learn are really just tools to help develop these two aspects. Someone like Mike Barr, who to me, sounds forced and like he has thrown a bunch of licks together, does absolutely nothing for me because i dont hear a melody line through his shredding.
If you want a good example of virtuostic playing, while keeping melody, go check out Greg Howe's take on sunny.
Uderoche> if he is going in another direction it doesnt sound very good. And thats what it comes back to.. how does it sound...and tbh did the sound in that video please your ear? it sure didnt mine.
Maybe im in the wrong place, but i certainly dont want to be the next buckethead. I would take 3 notes with good melody over 200 with shred technique with no relation to a melody.
Repetition in art, is the key to it all. I just dont find things like this impressive sorry guys.
Way too many guitarists forgot about melody in favour of virtuoso techniques, and its just plain wrong. Why? You will get away with playing the melody of a song as a solo, you will not get away with playing a bunch of ragtag techniques that do not fit.
Have we also forgotten the role of our instrument within a band?
Accompaniment instrument.....Which means u have to bring something else to the song ur accompanying.
Im all for the next guy standing up their making noise like mick barr, and maybe i just dont get what he is doing. But imo without a melodic context to see this is, it just sounds like a bunch of noise to me, and not very impressive.
So what if he is fast? He will never be faster than a sax or clarinet player anyway... in my eyes buddy speed comes entirely second to good melody.
Just watched the video..he plays very very fast...but what does it do melodically?
I hear no music in relation to the song...no chords and no melodic theme..
I dont really hear any chords through well thought out melodies.
Some great virtuostic technique, but IMHO i would like to see it in a much more musical format.
Just sounds like a bunch of riffs thrown together...not very impressive to me.
Cheers, Chris
P.S. Also being an audio engineer, i can hear the fact he is stiff in his right arm. He is picking fast by muscle the guitar, its not relaxed and smooth.
Where I come from and the players Ive hung around, they always tell you to use the heaviest gauge you can cosistently bend a whole step. This way you got the fattest tone you could use.
I use 10-46 on my main strat, but my tele and 50s strat i use 12-52's. Does wonders for the tone, and your hand does eventually speed up.
Mon Jun 14, 2010 5:02 pm
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